Charisse Deschenes (00:32)
Welcome to today's episode of Unmuted In today's episode, we're going to be talking a little bit about the art of being scrappy, leadership lessons from Paw Paw And it's going to be a little bit of a different episode as we're going to talk a little with Kellye.
This episode isn't about you know leadership and theory or even practice. It's more personal. We're talking about someone who really shaped you Kellye and that's your Paw Paw or Paw Paw. I need to say it for say it the proper way if you're from the south, correct? Paw Paw!
Kellye Mazzoli (01:03)
P-A-W, P-A-W, paw paw. Yeah, it was paw paw.
Yeah, that's it.
Charisse Deschenes (01:11)
And I know this week is especially it's especially meaningful to you because it's tied to the anniversary of his passing. And I just want you to introduce the listeners today to him and know that I'm here with you as you go through this journey and this discussion today. So who was Paw Paw and why bring him in this conversation?
Kellye Mazzoli (01:33)
Thank you for being so supportive, Charisse. I really appreciate that. Yeah, as you mentioned, this episode actually marks eight years since my Paw Paw passed away, which was October 5th of 2017. And for anybody who knows me or has listened to any of the podcasts that we've done where we talk about some personal stuff, I've mentioned Paw Paw. So I've been thinking about him a lot lately and I thought this would be a good time to honor his memory.
and honor what he means to me and introduce some really fun leadership lessons that he imparted to me just through his being. Paw Paw, his real name is Marion Bartow Lloyd and he went by Bart. Most people knew him as Bart. He did not go by Marion, which, but I love that name. But I used to call him Bartoo whenever I was really young.
Charisse Deschenes (02:22)
You
Kellye Mazzoli (02:23)
I would yell out, bar
Bartoo, Bartoo! I couldn't say Bartow And then eventually he became Paw Paw. And so all my friends over the years learned of Paw Paw and spent time with Paw Paw. And that's how they referred to him as was Paw Paw. So he was a, you know, he wasn't really a big man physically, maybe five, two.
He could claim maybe five, three with he had a built up shoe from when he had a leg that didn't bend. so his his left shoe had to be built up because that knee did not bend. It had been fused together. So, yeah, maybe five, three if you counted the built up shoe. But what he lacked in what he lacked in stature, really, he made up for in his personality. So he was very quick with a joke. He was very full of life. And honestly, I don't think I ever saw him intimidated by anyone.
my whole life. you know, maybe that's just, you know, kid looking up to her Paw Paw, but like he just never seemed to be intimidated by anyone. And he could strike up a conversation with everyone. It could be somebody in a suit who clearly had a lot of money in this world and even an astronaut, which he actually did at one point whenever he was in Houston. And in the next breath, he he'd be befriending a man who lived in a homeless shelter. So he wasn't
You know, and he wasn't all just talk either. So I have to say, like, he really he acted upon helping and serving others even he was in he was in the Navy. And so he served through his service there. But then even after he retired, he like befriended somebody at a at a shelter who he.
They just became friends and he found out that he needed dentures. And so he was the first to step up and just buy this man dentures just because he needed them. And that's just that's who he was. And, you know, in the Navy, he worked on airplanes. And so he used those skills and his time, his humor to help and make life just a little bit brighter for other people. So for me, what it comes down to, Paw Paw, he was my person.
The one who understood me, I think the best in this world, the one who made me feel really, really safe, secure, capable, loved, believed in all of the things. And not the only one, but he was definitely the one who who who was that constant in my life. And so that's why I really wanted to bring him into this conversation, because the lessons he left me are ones that I think about regularly. And I think they are ones that every leader could use, regardless of where they are.
in their career.
Charisse Deschenes (04:49)
I love that Kellye Paw Paw sounds like someone I really would love to have known and I'm sorry I didn't get to meet him and I've heard you describe him as scrappy and you know resilient and I just want to know what that means to you.
Kellye Mazzoli (04:59)
Yes.
I think scrappy is a good word to sort of just to embody Paw Paw's whole way of being like for him being scrappy meant doing whatever it took to accomplish something. And even when it wasn't pretty and even if it wasn't polished. So sometimes that meant that he was using duct tape to to duct tape something together. I mean, often.
Sometimes it meant like you had to make your own tool out of some of the tools that you had out of what you had. Sometimes it meant driving an old truck with no air conditioning in the middle of a Texas summer because that happened to be the truck that you had that could do the job that you were trying to do. yeah, so when I was little, I would be right there with him working on cars and my job was to handle the tools that he needed. And through that process, like I loved it. I loved being his helper.
And I'd be knee high, like not even five years old. And he'd be telling me what kind of socket or wrench to bring him. And I know he didn't need me to do that and to hand those tools over to him, but he knew where everything was. Like he just always did. And it's still though, it helped me feel like I was contributing.
Charisse Deschenes (06:00)
Mm-hmm.
Kellye Mazzoli (06:13)
and that I was helping and in the process I was learning and I was learning the names of the tools, but I was also learning the difference between that socket, the wrench and the importance of using the right tool for the job. I think, you know, whenever I think about scrappy, know, scrappiness isn't about chaos. It isn't about cutting corners necessarily. And Paw Paw always taught me that, that you, but you improvise. You need the right tools.
but there's a balance of creativity, there's a balance of intentionality, and that right there to me is like a leadership lesson gold star right there.
Charisse Deschenes (06:46)
Yeah, well, that kind of reminds me of the bolt story. And I just want to know, can you share that with everyone here? ⁓
Kellye Mazzoli (06:55)
Yeah,
so I love that you remember that. So, yes, we were working or I say we were working on an engine, but he was working on overhauling an engine. And there was this one bolt that he just could not budge on it. And I mean, no matter how hard he tried, it was stuck. And so Paw Paw, again, like I said, he was not a very big guy. He was a I wouldn't call him particularly strong. He wasn't weak, but he wasn't strong.
But he understood this concept of leverage. And so he took this wrench and he added a socket onto the handle. And when that wasn't enough, he added another and then he added another. And like this thing looked like some kind of contraption cartoon. Like it was just ridiculously long. And I remember him climbing up. had it because of course the cars raised up, the engines up like.
Anyway, so he has to get up on the step stool and he leans over and he's got this thing that he had built this tool and he literally like pushed down on it and it lifted him up off of the steps. Right. He's like all of his way. And then finally that bolt broke loose. Right. And that right there was just like that's classic Paw Paw. He he didn't muscle through the problem. He really he out thought it. He found another way.
And so I carry that. That's a great leadership lesson. I carry that with me today. It's that like whenever you hit resistance, it's not always about pushing harder. Sometimes it's about stepping back, looking at what what resources do you have in front of you? What's another angle? What's another tool? What's like? Who else can I bring in to help? And. You know, these are really important lessons in leadership that that you don't have to be the strongest. You just maybe you just need to be the most resourceful.
Charisse Deschenes (08:38)
I love that, Kellye. And I hear flexibility in what you're saying too. So not just force or even creativity, but the willingness to maybe adjust a little bit.
Kellye Mazzoli (08:48)
Oh yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's like packing a car for a road trip. And Paw Paw taught me how to do that. He loved to pack cars so full that you like you wonder if I mean you had just enough room to sit in there, maybe barely. But he taught me, like you put in the cooler, you you realize maybe the sleeping bags don't fit or, you know, the box or whatever. And so you take it out and you rearrange and you try again. And, you know, maybe I learned that from Paw Paw. Maybe I learned it from Tetris. But now he sure knew how. Yeah.
Charisse Deschenes (09:02)
You
You're wrong. Yeah. Little both.
Kellye Mazzoli (09:17)
Yeah,
he sure knew how to pack a car. But, you know, in that instance, I think the leadership lesson there was that, like, just because you tried something once, it didn't mean that you were stuck with it. Like, it wasn't permanent that just because you put the cooler in first that the cooler had to stay in first. And so sometimes you took it all out and you repackaged it. And that's how you got everything to fit. And that's how you accomplish your goal. So you can move things around. You can test other ways. You can see if something fits differently. And sometimes you discover
Maybe that you have more space and capacity than you originally thought.
Charisse Deschenes (09:50)
Yeah, well, and Paw Paw wasn't just teaching you about tools and packing cars. He was teaching you about people too, right?
Kellye Mazzoli (09:58)
yeah, the most important lessons, right? was constantly working on cars for people who honestly couldn't afford a mechanic. And like I said, he worked on planes and the Navy, so he had some know-how and he had some skills. You know, of course, before all the cars became fully electronic, but he was always learning new things and buying whatever manuals he needed to do that. one of the things he did that stood out to me,
was that he never charged for his labor. He would only charge those people for parts. And he never did it for any kind of recognition. It was literally just about helping people out to keep their lives moving. Because he understood, especially in Texas, it's very car driven, not a ton of public transit options. Like really, if you don't have a car, it's really hard to get around. And he knew that it was really important to these people for getting to and from their jobs.
getting their kids to the doctors and things like that. And he would do whatever it took to get their car up and running. and still even though people were in sort of these jams or in these serious positions in life, he always did it with humor and he would always crack jokes. And he literally did this to the very, end of his life. So yeah, even when things were tough, he could bring in some levity. And I think that's part of leadership too.
Like it's not just about solving those problems, it's about how you show up for the people whenever you're solving them. And there's humanity in humor. And I think honestly, that's one of the things that most people probably remember about him is just kind of how funny he was.
Charisse Deschenes (11:27)
He sounds amazing. I love that when you're talking about just the way he responds and helps people. And it taught you the same kind of lesson in life as how you really show up and you show up for people.
in need and you take care of them and you do have that skill as well. I can see where you get that from your Paw Paw. ⁓ Yes, so tell us a story about your accident in college because I think you said that that one really captures who he was.
Kellye Mazzoli (11:46)
Thank you.
Oh yeah, so I had a little minor fender bender car accident. to be clear, yeah, that one really is another classic Paw Paw. Like I was in college and at the time, of course, so I didn't really have any income to speak of and like kind of, know, ramen noodles kind of broke. But I slid off.
It was it had just sort of sprinkled a little bit and all the oil and stuff that had been sitting on the roadway kind of loosened up just enough and I went around a corner and it just I just slid like literally it was just unexpected I went up on a curb. So and my car was totally not drivable And I was in Austin and of course at the time I lived in Dallas Fort Worth area And honestly, it was just like what am I gonna do? Well, the first thing was is like, yeah, I need to call Paw Paw
And Paw Paw figured it out and he found a flatbed trailer and, you know, we needed a flatbed because my car couldn't be towed the other way with the way that I got up. You know, like it was all these things. But Paw Paw was like, no, I got it. Like he found a flatbed and then he had to find a truck and the truck that he found, of course, didn't have air conditioning. And here it is. It's hot. And he came and he picked me up and we got the car on and we got it back to Fort Worth and we just sweated it out in the truck.
Charisse Deschenes (12:53)
Yeah, yeah.
Kellye Mazzoli (13:08)
Right. It's that scrappiness of like it wasn't pretty. It wasn't great. It wasn't perfect. But in the process, like I just remember joking back and forth with him like he like he made me feel so much better even just about that I had I had wrecked my car, which I really loved at the time. And we got a fix right. And the tools and through the people that he knew. He used his resources to help. So we were able to do it, you know, where it was financially feasible for me at the time. And
I remember thinking like where there's a will, there's a way. Like I have just lived by that mantra. And I don't think like Paw Paw ever went around saying that this was his mantra. And I don't I don't know that he ever said it or not, but he just led that by example. And I think. You know what I took out of that is that conditions aren't always perfect and resources aren't always ideal. And that's so true in what we do in city management. But I do hold that if you stay determined that you can figure it out.
Like where there's a will, there's a way. I really, really do like lean into that wholeheartedly on a personal level, on a professional level, and I've just seen it repeated over and over in my life successfully.
Charisse Deschenes (14:14)
That's a good one. And you talk about leadership and you talk about Paw Paw, what is the biggest leadership lesson that he's taught you? Do you think?
Kellye Mazzoli (14:22)
The biggest I think is like, it's funny to say this because most of you know that I'm a recovering perfectionist, self-diagnosed, I'll be clear. But don't wait for perfect. Be scrappy, use the tools you have, look for that leverage, right? And try again if it doesn't work the first time. I think that we live in this world where we feel a lot of pressure to sort of like know everything, fix everything and to be flawless in it, especially I would say as women.
Although I don't think that men are, you know, like they still also have those same sort of pressures, maybe just in a slightly through a slightly different lens. But like a perfect presentation isn't needed and the perfect culture and the perfect response to a crisis, all those things. isn't leadership isn't flawless. Like it's just not possible. Leadership requires the humanity of things and humanness is just imperfect. So, yeah, sometimes it's messy.
Sometimes it's a little sweaty and it's rearranging things until they sort of fit. And I think that to me is sort of like the biggest lesson that I learned. Like the more resourceful, like you are more resourceful than you think. You are more capable than you're probably giving yourself credit for in the moment. And ultimately I think that's really the lesson that Paw Paw taught me.
Charisse Deschenes (15:35)
Yeah, I can feel how personal this is to you. ⁓ can you talk a little bit about what Paw Paw means to you beyond, know, beyond these lessons.
Kellye Mazzoli (15:38)
Hmm.
Yeah,
yeah, he was, he was my anchor, right? He was really a safe place for me. He was my favorite person in all the world. And I'd say with him, like, I really felt, I always felt smart. I always felt useful and I always felt capable. And honestly, he just believed in me in a way that made me believe in myself. And it's one of those things that you don't really realize until you reflect on it.
right? It was just a way of being. He gave me unconditional love. There were no strings. There were no conditions. He was always proud of me. It seemed like no matter what, like I could do no wrong, they say, but it was really true with him. And I think that that unconditional sort of caring and love is it's kind of rare. And I miss him so deeply because he showed me what it means to be seen, to be to be understood and to be loved in that way. So
Charisse Deschenes (16:40)
That's so beautiful, really is. And let us end with this, OK? If Paw Paw could leave one message for leaders listening today, what would it be?
Kellye Mazzoli (16:49)
I'd say do whatever it takes and crack a joke while you're doing it. Because otherwise, what's the point, right? Because leadership is really not about being perfect. It's about being persistent. It's about being resourceful and having a good laugh with the people that you care about along the way.
Charisse Deschenes (16:54)
Yeah. beautiful. Thanks Kellye for sharing today and for all our listeners out there remember to stay unmuted.
